Showing posts with label PnP DnD. Show all posts
Showing posts with label PnP DnD. Show all posts

Wednesday, June 19, 2013

Play by Post RPG's: Reflections after a year of gaming

A little over a year ago, I created an account at a site called dndonlinegames (now called RPGCrossing.com) to give play by post a try.  As a friend on that site has put it, my life is full of family, and so it is impossible at this point for me to schedule time for gaming with actual people around a table.  I was craving a gaming outlet pretty badly at the time, so I decided to give it a try.  It has been a fantastic experience, and has dominated my limited hobby time ever since.  Shortly after starting, I posted some first impressions about play by post.  Given that I've passed a year at this point, I thought I'd post some reflections.

What is play by post?

Play by post is the practice of playing RPG's like Dungeons and Dragons on an internet discussion board.  This video does a great job of summarizing what it's like to play at RPG Crossing:



How is it similar to playing around a traditional table?

In terms of the core of the game, play by post is very similar to traditional tabletop gaming.  The DM tells the story, which players can directly influence and shape.  We roll dice (using the forum's custom die-rolling plug-in) to determine outcomes when the DM requests it.  Players control their own characters.  They build their characters, maintain (online) characters sheets, describe their character's actions, and write (rather than speak) dialog.  Using attached images players and DM's wage battles, and if they use Google Docs Drawing, the players and DM's can each move their character tokens.

It's not some distant offshoot of transitional pen and paper gaming.  It *is* gaming.

How is it different?

Despite the similarities, the different medium makes for some particular differences.  Some of these are clear positives, and some are negatives that one has to deal with when playing these games.

Challenges to Play by Post

Play by Post is SLOW

This really is the big one.  I get really excited about gaming.  I want to play and play and play.  There are wonderful game concepts pitched every day at RPG Crossing, and I often want nothing more than to dive right into them.

The problem is that, because you're playing asynchronously with people from around the world, it's rare that one ever is able to post as a player (or even as a DM) more than once per day in a game.  Sometimes, it's more like once per week.  And sometimes, it's even less often than this.  Not only can this be maddening for the impatient--and I am a bit impatient--but it makes it hard to keep a game in your head from one week to the next.  If I don't take notes, I have a hard time remembering the names of the other PC's, much less the NPC's in the campaign (or even the main plot line!).

To illustrate the point, the game that I began last June, the New World, has been running continuously for over a year.  We've "recently" reached level 3, and just today I took my first combat turn as a level 3 character (I'm thinking that we've been through three or four combat encounters).  My own game, which is a tad more combat-oriented, has been running for 6 months, and my PC's are level 2 and have been through a total of 5 combat encounters.  And frankly, in both cases, the fact that we are at those levels is the result of a substantial amount of extra XP given for roleplaying.  Otherwise, we'd probably still be level 1!

The solutions I have for the pacing are twofold.  First, join more games.  The more you're in, the less slow each individual game feels.  Second, take lots of notes!  I don't do this as well as I should, and as I result I am sometimes scrolling through pages of old posts trying to find some detail from times past.  But when there is a quest, or there are important NPC, I try to jot them down in the notes section of my iplay4e character sheet.

Players disappear.  Games fizzle.

In large part because the games do run at a snail's pace, players will disappear.  And often times, it's without warning.  You'll be playing with someone for months, and then suddenly something will happen in their lives that leads to either a quick "I hope this is not farewell, but farewell" post, or, even more often, just silence.  In my game, six months old, despite doing a fairly extensive "background check" on each player to try to avoid disappearances, I lost two of my original seven players (and added one replacement).

Obviously, this can derail campaigns.  There's a temptation as a DM to make campaigns character-centric.  In fact, doing so might be rule 1 of DMing, and one of the best ways to engage one's players.  But if you build your campaign around a character, and that character leaves the game without warning, where does that leave you?  It's something that you always have to be prepared to handle in a play by post game.

Players aren't the only ones to disappear.  Just as often, it's the DM.  A lot of would-be DM's vastly underestimate the amount of time, effort, and commitment it will take to run an effective play by post campaign.  Or, they are prepared for it, but then experience a life change that changes their ability to commit time to a game.  I'm currently involved in five games, not including my own.  I've been involved in four other games that have crumbled because the DM disappeared.  In another, one of the two co-DM's disappeared within two weeks of the game getting off the ground, leaving the other to pick up the slack.

Game posts take time

Paradoxically, after you have waited for the game to come back to you, it often takes a substantial time commitment to make a good contribution to the game.  Sometimes, I can just sneak in with a quick post that will allow for a short response to the DM or other players.  When I can, though, I try to do at least two paragraphs.  Somewhere in there, I try to show how my character responds to what the players and the DM have just said, as well as to push something back for either the players or the DM to run with.

I type pretty fast.  But I don't compose quickly, and I'm not always the most creative person.  I'm probably slower than most, but it's not uncommon for me to spend a half-hour or more on a meaningful game post.

During combat, it's often easier to decide what my character will do.  But to do a good job of tracking my encounter powers (I use a "combat array" dashboard of sorts as an in-post character sheet), and to write evocative descriptions of combat, it still takes time.  It's fun, but it takes time.

Organization is critical

With players scattered all over the world, organization is really critical.  Players are responsible for keeping track of their characters' stats, loot, attributes, etc.  In a game like fourth edition, this is pretty critical, as combat can become quite complex.

And as a DM, it's even more important.  You can get away with just relying on player posts, but my own experience is that combat runs much more smoothly if a DM tracks not just the monsters, but also the players during the fight.  I maintain a fairly large page of tables and such during each encounter, and one of the things I have the hardest time remembering to do is to keep them updated.  But the players rely on those tables, as do I, to know what is happening during the combat.

Party coordination can be hard

At a table, the players can have a short conversation to decide what they want to do next in a matter of seconds.  In play by post, such conversations can take days to complete.  Add in a little bit of uncertainty that discourages players from chiming in, and you have a stalled game.

It really helps when a player or two takes the lead to keep the adventure moving.  As a result, I've been writing more and more of my characters to be leader-types of late.  Even my quiet ranger has become more assertive, helping to push the group forward when necessary (by actions if not by words).

Similar issues occur during combat.  Because each post tends to make up a turn, you have little opportunity to plan out strategy in advance, or even during combat.  Characters can shout back and forth from turn to turn, or players can make general suggestions to the party in the OOC forum (if the DM allows it).  But it nevertheless can be difficult to devise a coherent strategy in the middle of a fight.

On the other hand, one can see this as a benefit.  You certainly only rarely see players trying to directly influence the actions of other players at the table, which is all too common during pen and paper sessions in my experience.  Furthermore, outright metagaming is also often not a big issue.

Benefits to Play by Post

Roleplaying and Character Exploration

I first heard about play by post on the excellent Exemplary DM Podcast (which recently started releasing new episodes!), where it was described as largely a literary exercise.  While you will meet a lot of aspiring writers on play by post games, I have felt little pressure to try to become one.  And I am not a writer, nor do I have aspirations to become one.

At the same time, the medium of play by post demands that character posts be descriptive and evocative.  Otherwise, there's nothing really there to game with.  And in many ways, writing what your character says in third person (as is usually the custom) is far easier and less awkward for many of us than speaking your character's dialog out loud in a tabletop session.  As a result, very rarely do you see situations in which players are unable or unwilling to roleplay.  It doesn't take much: a paragraph or two, describing what your character does, along with a few lines of dialog, and you've made a useful contribution to the game.

Therefore, given this recent background, it's pretty hard to even relate when you hear tabletop DM complain about a lack of roleplaying at their table.  If there is one thing that the slow rate of the game tends to promote, it's introspection and exploration of one's character.  I think this is where the medium really shines--characters come to life in play by post more consistently than I've ever seen in a tabletop session.

Visuals

While this might offend the purists, one thing that I really like about play by post gaming is the ability to easily add visuals to your games.  As a DM, including an image of an important building, scene, or NPC is as easy as uploading to photobucket and adding the appropriate tag to your image.  The medium is always going to be dominated by the written word, but visuals can really help bring a game to life.

Doing the same thing at a tabletop game either requires a) print-outs, or b) a laptop at the gaming table, ideally with a secondary, attached monitor.

Records

When you walk away from a tabletop game after a session, the game exists only in your mind.  Some groups will try to take the time to write down what their group does in adventure logs, but this can be a time consuming and ultimately often thankless activity.  It certainly is also not one that lends itself to evocative writing--adventure logs tend to be pretty dry, point-by-point descriptions of what happened at a session.

In contrast, in play by post, every post contributes to the story of the adventure.  And those posts are essentially permanent.  As a result, a year later, you can go back and read an adventure almost as a novel.  And there are some folks who actually do this!  I've had at least one lurker who drops by my game and reads the wonderful stuff that my players have written.

Lessons learned

Play by post gaming has been a wonderful addition to my life over the past year.  It has given me a wonderful creative outlet and brought a lot of fun into my life.  It is not without its challenges, but my experience has been that there are tremendous rewards to getting involved in play by post games.

Monday, June 4, 2012

Joined a Play-By-Post Group

I got the good news today that I made it into a play by post group over at DnD Online Games.  I had gotten the impression some time ago that these kinds of games were almost entirely narrative-based.  But upon investigating, I found that the games that folks play over there can include combat, complete with grids, etc!  Given that I have essentially given up on injecting actual tabletop games into my life for the time being, this is probably my best alternative (in addition to video games).  I'm pretty excited to give it a try.

The game I joined is called The New World and designed by a guy who calls himself Enthusiast.  It's a neat concept: a well-established, culturally developed Empire discovers and colonizes a new continent, and we're playing just 30 years after the first settlement was founded.  The continent is populated by shifters, an indigenous people who possess primal magic.  The game is essentially the story of how this empire attempts to take hold in this New World.  Mine was one of 29(!!) different character applications submitted by 24 different people, so I feel incredibly fortunate to have been in the group of 7 that made it in...especially given that this was my first try!

Here is my character application:
Name: Erethil 
Race: Elf 
Class: Ranger (Hunter) 
Role: Controller 
Alignment: Good 
Deity: None 
Appearance and Personality:Erethil is smaller than a typical Elf, and is slightly built. Yet even by elven standards, he is unusually graceful. He moves about in smooth, quiet steps that allows him to go unnoticed in both the wilderness and urban settings. He has black hair that is often tied back, and sharp eyes that he uses to pan about the room. It is as if he sees everything. 
Erethil can come across as a bit gruff; he's generally quiet, but quick and to the point when he has something to say. He prefers to avoid long conversations and chit-chat, and has no qualms about walking for miles with a companion and not saying a word. That said, he has learned to work amicably in a team via his experience as a wildness guide, and is a reliable, generous companion to those he trusts. 
Background:Erethil was among the first Erathic children born in Medrona. His mother was a dignitary of some importance in Amarin, where her father was a sergeant in the local militia. When Erethil was just 10 years old, however, both of his parents went missing while traveling to Port Calia shortly after its founding. His parents were not wealthy, but left him with sufficient resources to survive until he had completed his education, while his mother's colleagues were available to help him on his way. 
Nevertheless, Erethil spent much of his teenaged years roaming the wilderness between towns. At first, it may have been in a desperate attempt to learn what happened to his parents. But the long months spent in solitude also brought Erethil solice. He found himself in awe of the combination of beauty and brutality in the natural world, and in time began to feel intimately connected to it. Through careful observation of the cunning fox, he learned how to deftly maneuver to avoid threats while in danger. By watching the wolf spider, he learned the power and efficiency of stealth and a sudden, deadly attack. 
Erethil became an accomplished hunter, renowned for his accuracy with the bow and uncanny ability to down his quarry with a single strike. His preferred hunting grounds are in the Oliddian Wood, the lush coastal forests between Olid and Amarin. Able to make a modest living selling game, he also has found employment as a guide. Wealthy Imperial citizens, recently arrived in Medrona, take comfort in hiring him as a guide as they travel between settlements along the coast of Medrona. 
While comfortable, Erethil continues to be drawn to the wilderness. He has rarely interacted with the nomadic clans of shifters that live on the continent. But what little he has seen of them hints at their deep connections with the natural world, which manifest in powerful primal energies and powers. When the Baron of Olid sent an appeal for adventurers to procure a mysterious artifact, Erethil jumped at the chance. Perhaps this artifact might hold some secret that would allow him to grow more in tune with the wilds. 
RP Sample:From his perch in the treetop, bow drawn, Erethil watches his prey. The deer has been milling about on the other side of the brush. While he could hit it now, the cover might keep him from targeting it precisely at the base of the neck. Such a strike would kill the deer instantly, preventing both pain for the animal and noise that could attract unwanted attention. With a bit of patience, soon he will have a perfect shot.
Suddenly, from within the brush, something stirs: the doe has a fawn! Lowering his bow, a small, contented smile forms on his lips. Erethil might not sell a deer today, but the snares he set up nearby were sure to provide dinner. For now, he could simply watch the beauty of a mother caring for her offspring.
 That RP sample took a long time to write, so I'm hoping I get faster at this kind of thing!!

My character sheet is currently hosted on DnDOG's character sheet system, though I'm looking at Character Distiller as an alternative...But that's a post for another day.

Sunday, January 22, 2012

Essentials Race & Class List

Very small thing: I'm rolling up (for fun) some characters from each of the Essentials classes.  I created a small spreadsheet that shows the various ability bonuses you get, and the special abilities they use.  I also identified which classes fit best with each race, based on nothing more than the key abilities noted in the Heroes books and the races that give you bonuses to those abilities.  Here it is:


(if that doesn't work, here's a direct link to the spreadsheet)

A few quick hits:

  • Drow gets the most class matches, thanks to the Dex + Wis or Cha combo.  Bah, I hate drow.
  • Half-Orcs not surprisingly make terrific slayers.  But I was surprised to see them show up as elite athletic thieves.
  • Knight, Slayer, and Cavalier all clock in as having just one ideal race.  
  • Least versatile race?  Eladrin, which only make elite Mages based on the abilities (though teleport could certainly make an eladrin dexstriker, like a rogue or scout, pretty darn interesting).
  • Most accepting class?  Hexblade, which needs good charisma and either good dex or con.

Monday, October 24, 2011

Custom Solo Creature: The Giant Crocodile

I'm putting together a level 2 adventure for when my band of four adventurers finish up the Twisted Halls.  I'm largely going to stick to the stock materials in the Monster Vault (I think), but I wanted a non-dragon solo monster for this adventure.  So, I put together my first custom solo creature.

Set up: the adventurers are entering an actively used mine.  As a minor (miner? haha) quest, the mine foreman asks them to try to figure out what happened to one of his miners.  The adventurers walk through the mines and come upon a "break room."  The room is a part of a cave that ends in a pristine underground river with good drinking water.  The room includes bed rolls, a campfire, stools, a make-shift picnic table, etc.  Miners often use this room to eat, sleep, etc.

Adventurers will notice that there is an abandoned pick-axe near the shore.  As they approach the shore, a gigantic crocodile leaps from the water.  If you've seen Crocodile Dundee, you might remember a similar scene involving a water bottle.  If the crocodile makes a stealth check against the characters' passive perception, it gets a surprise attack round to open combat.  Here's the monster:
As you can see, it's the crocodile from the DM kit, lowered to level 2, solo-ified, and then granted some special features from the Id Fiend (lv 1 solo from Dark Sun) and a fledgeling dragon.  I also increased damage to be comparable to that of a dragon.  I think it'll be a fun monster to face, though I may need to playtest it before I throw it at them in case it's too powerful.

When they defeat the monster, adventurers may cut open his gut to find a treasure parcel, which includes a locket bearing the lost miner's name. Returning the locket completes the quest.

Thursday, October 20, 2011

First Impressions: rpgKids

As I've been getting into DnD the last few months, my older daughter has been showing some interest as well. As I've discussed before, she is playing a knight in our family game with my niece and nephew, but she needs a lot of help to make it work.

Because we may go months in between sessions (rest of family lives a few hours away), I've been toying with playing a solo game with my daughter on the side. It was with that thought in mind that I happened again upon NewbieDM's rpgKids, a simplified game inspired by 4e dnd that is appropriate for a little kid.

I ponied up $5 for the original package plus his just released expansion pack. The rules are pretty simple, but there's decent depth to them. There are four classes (equivalent to ranger, fighter, wizard, and cleric), each with their own style of attacks and a unique set of skills. But regardless of your class, all combat ultimately comes down to competing dice rolls: the hero rolls a d12 against the monster's d12, and if the hero gets a higher roll, he hits the monster. There are a few roll modifiers, and you can complicate it as much or as little as you wish.

For example, I opted to add opportunity attacks and shifting to the game.  This was easy to do, makes the game a bit more tactical, and will be good training for her when we go back to the bigger kid table with true dnd. I also opted to give the fighter-type class more "hitpoints," which I think are appropriate to help balance him against the other powerful classes.  Coupled with opportunity attacks, this makes the fighter class an acceptable defender.

It took my 5-year old about 1 full round to pick up the core combat mechanics. By the end if the second round, she was pretty much independently playing her turns, which is great. That's not really possible in dnd right now. And she really enjoyed herself. She didn't want to stop when it was bedtime. She was into the story, loved defeating ghosts in our first encounter, and really enjoyed the artwork that comes with the manual.  She even got creative using her skills--as a ranger-type, she had the ability to track a foe into the woods, and she did a good job of coming up with that use of the ability herself.

I had a blast too.  Hopefully this will be a regular activity in our house!  I highly recommend dropping $5 for rpgKids if you're looking for a fun, creative activity to do with your little kids.

Tuesday, October 18, 2011

Dexter's Laboratory: Monsters and Mazes!

Via @TheAngryDM comes this brilliance from the archives of Dexter's Laboratory:

Dexter's Laboratory - D & DD

Vezi mai multe video din animatie

Monday, October 17, 2011

App Review: RPG Roller v.2.1 by Moondog Software

At its most simple: tap the button to roll
whatever combination of dice you desire.
When I bought my first round of DnD materials, I bought three sets of dice.  At the time, I expected that I'd be playing along with two other people, so this would cover us.  Since that time, our adventuring party has grown to a total of five people (myself included), which means we're a bit short on dice.  With that in mind, and in hopes of saving a little bit of time, I looked on iTunes for a dice rolling application.  This is the one I settled on: RPG Roller by Moondog Software.

This is an application designed for efficient play at a game table.  It does not try to recreate "the experience of rolling dice."  Instead, it is a customizable random number generator.  The most straightforward way to use the application is to use the Quick Buttons tab (right), which allows you to roll any combination of dice you could imagine (you sweep your finger to access bigger dice--d10's, d12's, d20's, and d100's).  Simply tap the button you want and your roll appears as a huge number in the middle of the screen.  If you blink/forget, it also shows the most recent roll in the upper right-hand corner.  You can also access your roll history via the tab at the bottom.

Players can add customizable
buttons for each attack and damage
roll.
Perhaps more exciting is the Hot Buttons tab, which allows you to customize buttons to your specific needs. For my DMing session this weekend, I just made a page with the dice rolls I'd need for the adventure: 1d20, 1d4, 1d6, 2d6, 3d6, 1d8, 2d8, 3d8, etc.  This way, I didn't have to sweep back and forth between the "big dice" and "small dice" pages.  It also let me add a bit more space in between clusters of buttons, which helps me avoid pushing the wrong button.

But if you desired, you could do what is shown to the right and create buttons for each attack and damage roll.  You can edit the formula to include any modifiers you desire.  For example, a Fledgling White Dragon's bite does 1d12+6 damage.  This can be programmed into a button.  When you push it, it will give you a number between 7 and 18.  It's neat.

For DMing, I prefer to just add in the modifiers myself, as the setup time to customize buttons for every single monster is a bit too much for my taste.  But a player might find it worthwhile to program all of his/her rolls into the device, since there are fewer combinations.  This could be especially helpful for younger players who are a bit slower with the math.  You can use color codes to help you find buttons on the screen too, which is neat.

There are other nice little features.  For example, you can go into the More tab and select "chart" and see a random distribution histogram for whatever roll you most recently submitted, along with summary statistics.  Beyond tickling my stat-nerd fancy, I can see this being handy when explaining the difference between a 1d12 and a 2d6 weapon.  There's also an option to prevent the iPhone screen from shutting down when the app is running, which is very nice when DMing so there's never a delay when I need to roll.  You also can customize the sounds.  If you like, the app can make a noise that sounds like dice rolling whenever you roll.  I prefer a simple "click" sound to play along with the button press, and it does this as well.

I have two minor complaints.  First, the buttons are a little small.  Since I'm usually standing when DMing, I'd prefer to have the option to have buttons twice the height shown here so that I'd have a bigger target.  That said, I've yet to actually hit the wrong button as far as I know, so it's not a big deal.

Second, the input syntax for multiple dice rolls threw me for a small loop.  I tried to input a dragon breath damage role of "2d8+4."  This should give a range of results between 6 and 20 (2d8 give you 2 to 16, then you add four).  The software, however, will give you results between 10 and 24.  It's adding four to both dice.  I had to contact the author to figure it out; to get it to work properly, you have to input "2d8 + 4" (note the spaces; this apparently is designed to help minimize the use of parentheses on complicated rolls, though I'm guessing it causes a fair bit of confusion by end users).  Once you do it that way, it works great.

All in all, though, this is a terrific little app.  It's faster and quicker than rolling actual dice, and it frees up my physical dice for my players to use.  And it's free!  While there is unquestionably an aesthetic value in rolling the actual dice on the table, there are situations (like mine) in which you need an alternative.  If you're in one of those situations and have an iPhone, I highly recommend RPG Roller.

Saturday, October 8, 2011

The Last Will and Testament of James Darkmagic I

I spent my evening watching the Penny Arcade guys play D&D 4e alongside Wil Wheaton (yes, that one) and the guy behind the PvP comic tonight. It's about 65% jokes and screwing around--and it's very funny--but interspersed in all that, Chris Perkins told a fun little tale full of memorable characters. I'll never get those hours back, but it was fun to watch and it scratched my D&D itch for the evening. Perkins is an extremely good DM. I'd like to watch him run a more traditional game sometime.

I get to DM my little family/kids game next weekend, and I'm really looking forward to it. The party has changed a bit, and should allow for a fun adventure through the Twisted Halls... More on that later....

Wednesday, August 24, 2011

Learning to DM via Pen and Paper blogs

Dungeons and Dragons!Image by Chorazin via FlickrAs I mentioned a few days ago, I'm thinking of starting a small campaign with my nephew and maybe a few other family members.  As I've waited for my 4/e stuff to arrive (darn you super saver shipping!), I've taken to reading a few pen and paper blogs.  Here are a few of my early favorites:

NewbieDM.com
This blog chronicles a DM's early attempts (starting about three years ago) to start playing a DM.  This post includes a host of very helpful advice and information.  I'm particularly excited about his made-at-home tokens and status markers.

Roving Band of Misfits
This seems like a fun, general D&D 4/e blog.  They have a very good podcast as well that I'm now subscribing to.  I much prefer it over some of the other offerings I've tried.  They do some fun crafts, like this cheap beholder miniature.  I'm also really diggin' their Two Page Mini Delves series (I'm linking to the second in the series, which is fairly new).  Since my "campaign" will invariably need to involve the use of very small dungeons and such, these are perfect...and have a nice flourish of creativity that keeps them from being a simple hackfest.

Sly Flourish
This is a site that is specifically dedicated to providing tips for DM's.  He is hawking his books via the site, but his content is very good and very helpful.  I was very happy to find his "Start Here" link, which lists many of his more helpful posts.  His 4/e buyer's guide very helpfully turned out to recommend exactly what I've already purchased, so that was reassuring...and it helped me realize that I will want to get that monster vault at some point, along with some tilesets.  I may buy at least one of the books on his site, as the freely available stuff seems very good.

Dungeons Unlimited
This is a newer site, but it's neat.  Basically, the guy is posting some of his many dungeons that he has created.  They're absolutely lovely, and should be printable for later use should I decide to use them.  I would love to get a hold of the mapping software he uses, though apparently it is no longer downloadable.


That's what I've found so far.  Any others I should be watching closely?

Saturday, August 20, 2011

Planning a 4/e adventure

So I've ordered my DnD stuff and look forward to its arrival next week. And I've gotten parental approval from the nephew's mom, who also was interested in playing. So we're on track for a fun party-of-three adventure (I'll play a third party member, largely as a henchman). My wife is thus far completely uninterested, but that means she can watch our kids during the games. :)

I'm going to start with the Starter Set adventures, as that will help them roll up a first character and learn the most basic game mechanics. It will also give us a basic adventure to help me learn the ropes of a DM. After that, however, I'm getting interested in designing my own adventure.

Or an adaptation of an adventure. While I have an old module idea that I eventually would love to try in pen and paper, it would be fairly involved and perhaps too mature for an 8-year old. So I'm thinking that our first several adventures might be adaptations of NWN modules. Snickersnack!, which I just finished the other night, could be a great opening module, assuming I can recreate the humor of the kobolds (and find a more level-appropriate quest reward). It's simple, short, and fun. And Cave of Songs is another that might translate very well: powerful ideas, but very little required long dialog and a lot of stuff that could be cut or embellished as needed.

I'm getting ahead of myself a bit here--they may try this and hate it--but this should be fun. DMing will no doubt require preparation, but I'd guess the hours requirement is at least an order of magnitude lower than creating an effective NWN module.

Now if only my books would arrive quickly. I'm looking forward to learning the 4th edition rules. I'll roll up one each of a fighter, rogue, wizard, and cleric, so I can choose a character to complement my players' choices.